Comments on: Sowing Salt: Eliminating Toxic Attitudes https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/ Play More, Win More, Pay Less Thu, 26 Nov 2015 14:23:46 +0000 hourly 1 By: Anonymous https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122782 Thu, 26 Nov 2015 14:23:46 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122782 In reply to Robin Taylor.

I agree with you for the most part. All we can do is spread positivity in gaming environments and let unpleasant players know how their behavior affects the community. I think open communication is key here, since it creates the sense of trust now lacking between players. Taking the easy way out and playing on MTGO robs the game of that critical human aspect you crave even now, and doesn’t do anything for the game as a whole. We’ve got work to do!

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By: Jake Golle https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122781 Wed, 25 Nov 2015 16:48:10 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122781 Great article, but I find it hilarious how you criticized Paulo for getting salty about losing with Jeskai Twin, and what variant was it that took first place at Pittsburgh?

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By: Robin Taylor https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122780 Tue, 24 Nov 2015 19:25:18 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122780 I recently stopped playing Magic after a few years of competitive play solely because of the people. It suddenly was clear that I invested my precious time playing against unfriendly people in a stressful environment. Why?

As I started playing Magic it was fun, I learned the game, then I slowly got into the competitive scene. Most players I met should enjoy the game, instead they chose to be stressed, salty and unsocial.

I remember playing in a GP where my opponent refused to take off his headphones while playing the game because this allowed him to feel like on MTGO. No interaction with the real human being on the other side of the table, in this case: me. Thinking about the last years I could fill pages with similar stories. Before quitting completely I tried to play FNMs again and came to the same conclusion. Unfriendly, stressed and unsocial individuals. I don´t want to spend my time on a hobby where I am unable to relax. I´d say every third pairing was a negative experience. If I´m not able to play a single FNM without one of four opponents being overly salty / snarky, then this is not the game for me.

Too bad, because I really love the game. Maybe I should try MTGO, though wouldn´t that make me unsocial? I think of myself as a friendly person with a pretty good mood, I always felt worse after an evening at the card shop.

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By: Jordan Boisvert https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122779 Tue, 24 Nov 2015 01:56:01 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122779 In reply to lucasB.

Yep, I laughed out loud when I saw the results. I do have two comments to make on Jeskai Twin winning the GP:

– The deck that won the GP is built very differently from the one Paulo piloted, which relied more heavily on Wall of Omens. The winning build seems to splash mostly for a full set of Path, which Paulo neglected to run
– The deck seems much better against all that GW aggro

Yep, still looks bad. Hopefully readers come away from this article understanding its goals, and not focusing on my unfortunate comments about Jeskai Twin.

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By: Roland F. Rivera Santiago https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122778 Mon, 23 Nov 2015 17:22:44 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122778 I love this article. It’s high time people started acting civilly around each other and working together to grow the community. I’ve said time and again that you can be competitive without being a jerk, and this piece offers some good advice as to how to make that happen.

Also, what is that Paulo Vitor guy’s problem?

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By: Jorge https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122777 Mon, 23 Nov 2015 16:59:18 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122777 “At GP Porto Alegre, he played Jeskai Twin, arguably the worst Twin variant in Modern. ”

I know hindsight is 20/20, but… ooops?

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By: lucasB https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122776 Mon, 23 Nov 2015 16:40:30 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122776 “Paulo’s petulance lands him firmly in the “toxic” camp. At GP Porto Alegre, he played Jeskai Twin, arguably the worst Twin variant in Modern. Instead of owning up to a poor decision, Paulo lashed out on Twitter, learned nothing, and continued to hate Modern. His unwillingness to learn how Modern works guarantees more failures.”

Aaaaand now Jeskai Twin just won a GP.

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By: Rik Dean https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122775 Sun, 22 Nov 2015 20:42:16 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122775 Nice to see someone reflect my views on dropping.

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By: Jordan Boisvert https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122774 Sat, 21 Nov 2015 18:15:05 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122774 In reply to Anonymous.

They still need opponents to alienate. If enough people tell them their behavior is uncool, and understandably refuse to play more games with them after a match or trade with them etc., they’ll come around. Nobody likes to feel excluded, and it’s not fun to exclude someone on purpose (for most of us). But we have a responsibility to call out antagonistic behavior. Once they modify their behavior, I’m sure those players will have fun being accepted into new friend groups and asked to come over for late night drafts, too.

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By: Francis Jodoin https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122773 Sat, 21 Nov 2015 17:15:00 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122773 Great read, i enjoy these kinds of article the most. By making us better players we become better persons, which is the most important thing.

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By: Anonymous https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122772 Sat, 21 Nov 2015 14:29:11 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122772 Soooo… What do we do with the players who get a kick out of the opponent’s saltiness? You know, the players who enjoy making their opponents salty. The ones whose fun level is parallel to the opponents salt level.

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By: Brendelton https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122771 Sat, 21 Nov 2015 01:05:30 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122771 Very well written and important for all mtg players. You are a magic player I would love to play against. This attitude is one of the reasons that vintage is still my favorite format (proxy or no proxy), people play the game for pure enjoyment. Still love modern, though I am not so great due to not having blue cheating cards :).

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By: LewisCBR https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122770 Fri, 20 Nov 2015 20:46:10 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122770 In reply to DNLK.

Being ‘the princess’ and getting offended all the time reminds me of an event one time involving the people sitting next to me. Jokingly, one guy said to the other, after losing the die roll, “So, do you want to draw first or have me play first?” and the other guy flipped the fck out. Called a judge, said his opponent was being misleading and was practically almost in tears. I dont know what to do about that kinda stuff..

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By: DNLK https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122769 Fri, 20 Nov 2015 18:36:54 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122769 Very nicely done article, thanks!

What I want to point at, though, is another side of toxic behaviour called by some people as “being a princess”. There’s always that one (or more) guy who gets offended by anything. Just because he thinks he should or something else, can’t say for sure. More humor, less poker faces struggling to not crack from tension.

Remember that one dude who got to a tournament and shot lots of pictures of, excuse me, asses of players? That was freaking hilarious and I appreciate his approach! Others haven’t been that ironic about all thing and got mad. They were being princesses.

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By: Rory Alexander Farrell-Madden McDonough https://www.quietspeculation.com/2015/11/sowing-salt-eliminating-toxic-attitudes/#comment-2122768 Fri, 20 Nov 2015 17:50:12 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=5641#comment-2122768 Good article.

For my part, I try to be honest with myself and my opponent even when I win. I’ve had a lot of opponent’s get salty after I made a lucky topdeck to win the game, and in those situations, I’m more than happy to own up to the fact that, yes, I absolutely needed to draw X, Y, or Z there and I lucked out.

I had this happen recently with a Merfolk – Affinity match at a 1K. I drew a Harbinger of Tides just in time to bounce my opponent’s Inkmouth and keep him from swinging for lethal Infect damage on his turn, and that bought me the turn to swing for lethal myself and close out the match. My opponent was clearly very annoyed that I always managed to “have it”. I was more than happy to own up to the fact that, yes, that was only one of maybe 6 outs I needed to win the game at that point and that clearly I needed to get lucky to win what is honestly one of Merfolk’s worst match ups. At the same time, I know that one of the reasons I run a card like Harbinger or other answers is because they can give me the kind of tempo swing to keep myself alive and close out a game and often make excellent top decks; I’d much rather have a 10-15% chance of winning that match at that point than no chance at all. Also, while Affinity is a bad match-up for Merfolk, it still wins a decent amount of the time; we all have to be prepared to be utterly destroyed by our best match ups from time to time!

With regards to dropping, I will often drop an event once it becomes clear I have no chance of cashing. This is because at the end of the day, I do have other priorities than Magic, and if I go X-2 or X-3 early on in a tournament, I might as well spend the rest of the day hanging out with my wife or doing something else, and generally that’s freeing me up other time to focus on Magic some other time during the week anyway. It’s rarely about the actual stakes for me, but rather that I do like the idea of winning or doing well in the event as a whole, so when that goes away, it’s one less reason to stay.

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