Comments on: Midrange Languishes: Analyzing SCG Orlando https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/ Play More, Win More, Pay Less Sat, 24 Sep 2016 19:52:19 +0000 hourly 1 By: Tom https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126794 Sat, 24 Sep 2016 19:52:19 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126794 Trevor underestimating RG Breach as usual. I get that you don’t like the deck but the results are there.

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By: Jason Schousboe https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126793 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 18:14:37 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126793 In reply to Felicia Doan.

I realize these two articles express slightly different opinions—that’s because they are written by different authors. Here at MN we’re interested in presenting as much fact as possible, but opinions will enter into the equation and we can’t provide a perfect unified front.

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By: Zach Stackhouse https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126792 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 14:16:40 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126792 In reply to Felicia Doan.

Which is it, indeed, because certainly two people that write for a website are not allowed to submit articles that may have different perspectives…

Come on, one article is to say that sky, is not in fact, falling, the other is looking at metagame data from a tournament and drawing observations.

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By: Tiago D'Agostini https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126791 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 13:27:29 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126791 In reply to Felicia Doan.

Well, different authors will have different opinions. Probably the truth lies somewhere between.

My view is that modern is extremely healthy format in small scale tournaments that have great variety of decks, but when you go into huge, long tournaments with 12 rounds, then the meta usually is different and a bit more “coward”, in a sence that peopel knwo they cannot deal with all decks in a huge player base, so they go for the race.

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By: Ricardo da Silva https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126790 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 10:06:45 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126790 Not only Bant Eldrazi, but the rise of both Dredge and Valakut has contributed to the unviability of midrange/control strategies in modern, the inevitability and resilience they present are too much to handle for fair strategies, thus people are forced to use unfair linear decks to try and go under.

Oh, and you mentioned the wrong Borborygmos while talking about Goryo’s 😛

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By: Tiago D'Agostini https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126789 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 09:17:00 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126789 In reply to Aaron Elias Newbom.

It is as fair as jund almost, considering it drops the 2 most powerful modern cards (goyf and bolt)

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By: Tiago D'Agostini https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126788 Fri, 23 Sep 2016 09:14:30 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126788 In reply to Aaron Elias Newbom.

As I said.. if you feel the need to do something, I would first unban the elf before banning other decks. On current Jund modus operandi you really think brodbraid would make so much difference? Most of the decks would not trade kalitas for it..

DRS is just a rant of mine how cards are banned without real reasons, just lazy work It was banned because its a too good card.. oo great. There is no single interaction that made it broken. In fact its banning changed NOTHING on Jund status. They said “but it makes2/3 of deck play either green or black..) surprise! 2/3 of the decks still play either green of black! It changed NOTHING! (except making goyf stronger)

It is just an example like how early modern bannings were badly made (same history as with wildcat)

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By: Felicia Doan https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126787 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 23:41:06 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126787 This article seems like a contradiction compared to Ryans http://quietspeculation.com/addressing-modern-critics/
So which is it?

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By: Felicia Doan https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126786 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 23:37:44 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126786 In reply to Álvaro Castro.

Couldn’t agree more. Hardly believe this is a ” Villain” deck. Lol!

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By: Aaron Elias Newbom https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126785 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 22:14:20 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126785 In reply to Álvaro Castro.

Exactly my first reaction but no. It’s actually a very linear in it’s approach, interacting minimally to enable itself more than anything (thoughtknot is there to stop you from stopping them)

However post board it does become more of a midrange deck.
It’s kind of like a halfway between from and midrange

It’s a “fair” deck as they like to say here. But more like ‘fair’. Just one set of marks haha. It’s close enough.

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By: Aaron Elias Newbom https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126784 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 22:07:58 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126784 In reply to Tiago D’Agostini.

I must heartily disagree with your unban suggestions XD

Jund is unwaveringly tier 1 without them. As much as I would love to play those cards in non Jund it would jus take Jund too good

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By: Aaron Elias Newbom https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126783 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 22:05:27 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126783 In reply to Jeramie Pfeffer.

Shhhh don’t let them know!

I’ve been playtesting it in my waste not deck. The card is bonkers. Really pushed for card selection.

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By: Aaron Elias Newbom https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126782 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 22:01:19 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126782 In reply to Jeramie Pfeffer.

Can I just say I don’t really appreciate the elitist tone and dismissal of anything less than common (8-rack and knightfall)

I always get this sort of time from modern players, despite success (6-3 at gp La, fnm wins, and top 8 in regionals) people scoff at my decks and chalk it up to luck because that deck must be bad.

I mean I was first seed going into top 8 at my last regionals (san diego, which also includes LA and people from vegas etc. and Tijuana. So a very high population area) I get so much shit talking from people.

Idk. Bothers me when people dismiss a decks success. And I feel it does those decks and players an injustice.

Why is knightfall so well positioned? I’d really like to know (I have a deck very similar but less zoo-ish and more controlling)

Sorry if this sounds like a rant but as an active subscriber I just wanted to give my feedback on what I perceive to be a bit of an issue

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By: Chris Striker https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126781 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 21:50:04 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126781 In reply to Tiago D’Agostini.

A sinkhole equivalent isn’t bad, but we have Smallpox. Perhaps a different focus for BGx decks.

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By: Jeramie Pfeffer https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126780 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 18:45:22 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126780 I believe the big card will be Cathartic Reunion. Everyone is all about it understandably in Dredge. But I think this gives pyromancer ascension based decks a big boost as well. Being able to select which 2 cards ahead of time (aka discarding a Cathartic Reunion to value trigger the one you cast) and getting three cards is huge. Not to mention a live ascension with this is just plain busted. Also vengeance decks get to play setup and draw three. Tormenting voice was playable in some versions already. This is a huge upgrade. This could be an easy inclusion in some young pyromancer/snapcaster decks too. It just goes on. The draw three side is pretty relevant.

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By: Tiago D'Agostini https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126779 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 18:42:44 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126779 Nothing needs to be done, the meta is self fulfilling. If decks like infect and knightfall rise, then jund will prey upon them naturally.

If changes are wanted I would look to unban a few things instead. Specially things that are good at delaying other decks or/and are not so cheap manawise. Unbanning brodbraid elf for example. I would even unban DRS before banning anything on current meta (it hurts dredge and it does not make any deck broken by any super synergy).

Sometimes I think what this format needs is a 2 mana LD with a heavy side effect, something that would work wonders to halting super linear decks.

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By: Álvaro Castro https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126778 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 18:34:18 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126778 But Trevor, isn’t Bant Eldrazi a midrange deck?

Sure, it plays a bunch of pushed creatures and it fast draws are mana acceleration (Noble, Temple) may seem unfair and all, but isn’t it just a bigger Jund? It baiscally plays 12 Goyfs, interacts with the hand (TKS), has removal (Path, Dismember), both Displacer and Drowner scream interaction and it even runs sideboard counterspells, Explosives, Alliance, Elspeth.

Just food for thought.

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By: Leander Tupper https://www.quietspeculation.com/2016/09/midrange-languishes-scg-orlando/#comment-2126777 Thu, 22 Sep 2016 17:31:35 +0000 http://34.200.137.49/?p=11655#comment-2126777 I’m not normally one to jump on the ban-wagon, but do you think a hierarch ban could help the format slow down? it’d slow eldrazi down substantially (they can still t1 dork, but it keeps them from slamming in with a 5/5 thoughtknot), and it’d depower infect a bit, so things could slow down. i mean, dredge is still an issue, as is zooicide, but it gets things much closer to managable.

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